And just a thought [flogging dead horse icon] the patterns of and reasons for language disappearance even in places nearby (Cornwall, Ireland, Isle of Man, parts of Scotland) surely provide us with some lessons to learn relevant to what may be happening in Wales at the moment, and thus maybe help us in thinking of what could be done about the matter here and now?
Relevant to this site, anyway. Plenty of other things, in my opinion, anyway- as you say, just an opinion!
First of all can someone sweep this interesting discussion to its own thread
Where did you get that impression, Owain? My whole point is that these subjects stand on their own and are answerable only to our quest for knowledge not for making better widgets or increasing our GDP. This is apparently a minority view because I very often get asked, when I explain Iām a physicist, what use my work is. In my old age, Iām afraid I tend to give a very short response. If I understand you right and you understand me right, we hold nearly identical views.
Aran gave a very good example of an historical episode which is in fact of current relevance but Iām not totally won over to the general point. I feel that a study of the contemporary fields of Sociology, Psychology, Anthropolgy, Politics, Economics is more likely to give fruitful guidance than studying the behaviour of our ancestors in a smaller, agrarian, pre-internet, pre-industrial world.
I canāt honestly pretend that semantics is responsible for the length of this discussion but I do think there has been some simple misunderstanding including on my part.
Ah, my fault!
I was trying to say you were saying the opposite to the idea that Egyptology had to justify its existence through an increase in GDP!
I of course ended up saying the opposite to that by accident! Oops!
Damn these āwordā thingsā¦
But yes, I certainly think that History is best studied for its own sake, but I do not agree that no lessons of relevance can be learned from it.
And that the fields you mention probably do take history into account and learn from them! (But I can only speak for the fields of Politics and Economics there, and then only in a small way.)
Agree 100%, Owain - weād be much better off without them.
Diolch am esbonio 
Huw
You could do that if youād reply to as a linked topic ā¦ but now replis are inhere already and only admins/mods can do the work. 
Thanks, Tajana - Iāll know in future but I guess Iām going to rely on a friendly admin/mod this time
Youāll just have to.
And, youāre welcome. I obviously am better ātech helperā then ālanguage oneā.
When I did the tour of Cardiff Castle the guide asked if there were any Welsh speakers whoād like the tour in Welsh as well
Also, just a thought. If schools are Welsh medium up to the age of 7, thatās enough to get kids (even from English speaking families) fluent, and if thereās one thing that will keep those kids speaking Welsh, itās being able to talk to all their friends in a language their parents donāt understand!
A family friend moved to Germany, and decided to put their two young girls in the local German school rather than an English international school. Even when on holiday in the UK, those girls will talk to each other in German and treat it as their first language, despite having two English parents who speak English to them at homeā¦
Haha. I know this thing from first hand. The problem is I speak too many languages - English included.
I hold this for very wise thing to be done. I had a schoolfellow whos mother is Slovene and father is English and to the top of all they first lived in France then mooved to London and they also lived some years in Germany. She speaks English, French, German and Slovene fluently. She is not only fluent speaker but also has all those accents of all languages she speaks from areas where she lived. It was like a song listening to her speaking in all those languages and it was all thanks to the fact that she always went to their local school rather then going to international English school. So yes, this is a good idea and Cymraeg could be developed the same way as suggested above.
When very young kids are involved itās brilliant to see how fast they learn one language in deed and in that stage (if we - adults - are not too persistent with some āideasā about the language) they never question why they should speak it, they just communicate in it as well as in their first language and thatās it. And theyāre even proud they know some other language then just their own.
Tjana, youāre my heroine !!
āand if thereās one thing that will keep those kids speaking Welsh, itās
being able to talk to all their friends in a language their parents
donāt understand!ā
We certainly know that, as we despair at how they speak English to each other, and as to the mysteries of text speakā¦
But they seem to learn this kind of thing by osmosis, no teacher has ātaught it at themā. Maybe thatās one of the keys, creating the osmotic conditions to pick up Welsh, then reaching a critical mass which will perpetuate itself.
āTjanaā? Just to be sure, do you mean me? If yes then I love it āTjanaā
Heroine? Hmmm ā¦ I donāt recall I did anything heroic in my life.
However if you mean me and picture above, I just love to show off what I love and promote whatās worthy to promote, what SSi surely is more then that! Itās a must do to me!
I have always loved learning history and did not start doing so to find lessons within it! I do think we can see patterns in behaviour which it should be possible to learn from, but,unfortunately, often, we just repeat the mistakes!! I do presume that nobody likes to see ancient statues, buildings etc. vandalised and demolished as IS are doing now. Is it reasonable to admire what our ancestors, or someone elseās ancestors made?? I think so.
I do not like the ācelebrationā of Waterloo or WW1 or WW2. I actually think Marshal Ney sold Napoleon out. Heād told the King heād capture Napoleon, seemed to join him, but Waterloo should never have been faught if heād done as he was asked and made any effort at all to advance at Quartre Bras.
The British government now do not seem to see anything wrong with their ancestors paying for years of warfare designed to make the French accept a king!!! Is it a bit like going to war to get rid of the ruler of Iraq???
I know a couple who did the opposite. i.e. they put their kids into an international school rather than the local German school. Eventually however, they felt that the international school was not working, so they brought the kids back to England to go to school here. The kids are as bright as buttons and will do well Iām sure, but it seemed to me that it was a lost opportunity for them to be as bright as buttons in two languages rather than just one. The parents are nice, intelligent, highly educated and successful in their own right, but this seemed a strange decision to me. However, there may have been factors at work to which I was not privy.
This is why I am learning Cymraeg! 
I am English and have been living in Cymru for 9 years but visiting for 40 years. I love everything about this beautiful country and her people are delightful. Therefore I would love to see the country become at least truly bi-lingual. If people like myself continually move to Cymru and only speak in English, then the language can only be slowly diluted.
I absolutely love the language and have no desire at all, to contribute to a decrease in its use. Since I have been seriously learning, I have been encouraged to meet not only many Welsh people learning the language but also quite a lot of English and some other nationalities too.
One thing I have been doing for quite some time, is downloading the first couple of lessons from SSIW, and passing them on (via CD or memory stick) to anyone who shows any interest in Cymreag at all. My contribution to encouraging people to learn.
Hope some of them are comming back to you wanting the link to the site being eager to learn.
Iām trying to get my friend here to learn for as long as I learn but she just didnāt decide to do so yet. I see sheās highly tempted as I speak in Cymraeg sometimes and then translate what Iāve said to my co-workers but it seams too hard for her to form words (at least she says so) so she always says she wouldnāt learn the language. I believe she, more then anything else, didnāt gather that courage to start at all. Well one day maybe ā¦ who knows. But, sadly, this will not make any contribution to Cymraig areas themselves but at least language in general can be preserved this way.
hi, yes it is good to see someone promoting SSIW and especially so far from Wales. I have a SSIW eisteddfod t shirt that I wear sometimes and i nearly always get someone comment on it which gives me a chance to talk about my love of the Language .
I do in fact give them the website for SSIW along with other contacts & ways of learning with the recordings. I talk about Cymru & Cymraeg constantly as I am sure many others do. Butā¦we need to promote Wales, as I still know people even in England, who still donāt realise Cymru is a country itself and its not a place in England. I enjoy very much having visitors and taking them around this stunning country.
I do think you are amazing Tatjana to be learning Cymraeg from such a distance. Thank God for SSIW and the Internet!
I only just found the SSIW shop today after seeing Tatjana wearing her tee shirt and drinking from her mug! I will have to start shopping soon!