Using nag yn

Level 2 of challenge 3… Nag yn ni’n gallu that we can’t.
Can this be used for other situations:
nag yn dw i’n gallu that i can’t
nag yn ti’n gallu that you can’t.


Almost and you are very very close, they are - nagw i, nagwyt ti, nagyw e, nagyw hi, nagyn ni, nagyn nhw

or something very close to that, if anyone wants to correct them


These are, however, a pronunciation drift (typical of the S, I think) from the original, which ought to be nad (that…not):

…nad ydw i’n gallu - that I can’t
…nad wyt ti’n gallu - that you can’t

So it’s partly a dialect thing.


Diolch Gareth. That make sense to me now. As a learner I prefer to learn standard ways of saying things until I they become embedded, then introduce local variations.


Yes, @garnetcalder - I think that is a very sensible approach.

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a lot of younger speakers know the standard speech anyway … Dwi’n edmygu’r tafodieithoedd, gyda llaw (I admire the dialects, by the way)

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A finnau / Me too. Especially the exotic Gog ones, because they come from so very far away…

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Sbensh is one from my parents area … Dyffryn Clwyd … Cwtsh dan risiau (cupboard under the stairs)

And then there’s the classic … Cagle or Cagla :wink: :wink:

There are some good old sound clips of all the various dialects as they were spoken a long time ago now on the museum of Wales website - I think its from St Fagans. This one is Treforys or Morriston, but following this link will let you get to the others.

I put this one here, because there’s a couple of nagw’s for good measure, but also I have no idea what the following means and wouldn’t mind finding out if I could - highlighted in bold hopefully.

Odd y merched yn myn’ i dai tafarne?

Na, na byth. Odd ddim merch câl myn’ i dafan.

Beth… ôn nw’n ‘ala ‘i mâs, ôn nw?

Dele ‘i ddim miwn. Cele ‘i ddim myn’ miwn. A odd snug— gwelsoch chi’r
snug eriôd?

Edit: I think I’ve worked out the ala 'i mas bit now - Hala hi mas - send/chase her out


Beth… o’n nhw’n (ei) hala hi mâs, o’n nhw?

What… they were sending her out, were they? - hala is southern for anfon/gyrru, mâs is southern for allan.

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thanks - it must have crossed with my edit - makes sense. Any idea on dele and cele?

I think dele 'i ddim is dylai hi ddim but there’s something missing to make that a full sentence with mewn, so I’m not sure.

Cele I have no idea, unless it’s related to cael in some peculiar southern conditional way.


that would make sense. She shouldn’t (go) in, she wouldn’t get to be allowed to go in. ??

P.S. I also wonder if Dele is the conditional of Dere or another form of “dod” - she wouldn’t come in - she will not come in?

like in the Lord’s prayer “Deled dy Deyrnas” and other words like del and delwyf are forms of dod in some way, that I’m not really knowledgeable about.

Another addition:

Also I just found that: The colloquial conditional forms of Cael are:

cawn i or celwn i,
caet ti or celet ti,
câi fe/hi or celai fe/hi ,
caen ni or celen ni,
caech chi or celech chi,
caen nhw or celen nhw

And Dod has the same endings for the conditional, starting with del instead of cel, so delai hi, for the conditional form of dod. Drop the D and you get the mynd forms and add an N to the mynd forms and you get the gwneud forms.


So we have:

She wouldn’t come in. She wouldn’t get to/be able to go in.

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Sounds perfect - I wasn’t familiar with those at all, although I think I have come across them before. I just noticed that @garethrking has it all in his book as always.


Yes my next door neighbour (Skewen) used dera and cera, for come and go commands to her dog (usually with nawr at the end), so that seems to fit.

I don’t think you can call the centre of the known universe ‘very far away’… :scream:


I call Deimos, moon of Mars, quite far away… :wink:


I must say, the absence of Saes is markedly noticeable. I previously only had some exposure from Now You’re Talking and now note that there are words like ‘aros’, ‘hoffi’, ‘hoffwn’, ‘cyfaill’ and disappeared structures like ‘ro’n i’n’ becoming ‘o’n i’n’ instead when it’s the short form of roedden ni-a statement versus a question, I believe?
Were they all from 1913?

This how my grandparents and their neighbours would natter away when I was young - they came from the same place and would have been teenagers when this was recorded. He even sounds like my grandfather - dere ma gwboi, made me smile. The language itself isn’t that old fashioned, lots of people still talk like that today. There are English words - band of ope etc.