can I ask about joio- when I tried using it in Duolingo it would often be rejected - when I asked people why and gave “I enjoy a cup of tea” as an example of when I tried using it- the reaction was laughter- some people said to use joio means you REALLY have to enjoy something and you wouldn’t use it to “enjoy a cup of tea?” And my friend’s hubby who is a Welsh speaker pulled a face at using joio- but I spotted on a previous thread that joio is common in conversations? Is it true that’s it’s only for really really enjoying something? Or is it for enjoying anything? Thanks.
It’s quite regional how much it’s used. Some people never use it and always say mwynhau instead, while in some parts of south Wales you’ll hear people saying enjoio which I’m not that fond of myself!
I don’t think I would use it for a cup of tea, but I would say joio when talking about how much I enjoyed the Eisteddfod.
So your best bet is to go with what’s around you, what the people in your local area or Welsh-speaking friends say.
ah thanks -think I’ll stick with mwynhau for postcards then unless it’s something really wonderful!
I’d also add that people can be very quick to tell you what they feel are important rules which are actually just about how they currently feel - so you’ll hear people swearing blind that you should never use X in Y situation, and then sometimes you’ll hear them do exactly that
So take all that sort of stuff with a pinch of salt, don’t overthink your own usage, and it’ll all come out in the wash
Welsh, like all languages, has many ways of saying the same thing. It would be very boring if we all used the same words. It is true to say that some people look down on certain ways of saying things especially if that form derives from English. No language is pure, there are always words adopted from other languages and sometimes the adoption is obvious as in the case of ‘joio’. There are signs around Swansea that say “Enjoy” “Joio” which I find irritating because the two words have a different meaning. “Enjoy” is an invitation to enjoy whereas “Joio” means “enjoying”. to a non Welsh speaker it looks fine but I’m sure I am not the only person who disapproves. Enough of that little rant. You need to be aware of the different ways of saying things, pick one as your favourite and adopt that as your norm in your conversations.
The alternatives come in handy if you were to try your hand at writing because on paper, repetition of the same words can become too obvious.
So, as you progress through your learning of the Welsh language you will hone your own way of speaking, you will mentally note other peoples ways of expressing yourselves and begin to enjoy the richness of Welsh.
It doesn’t matter how long you spend learning, you will never learn everything. we are learning new things every day of our lives without being aware of it. Use Welsh as much as you can, don’t be afraid to make mistakes. Smile and keep talking!
thanks for the reply- yes I’ve decided to revert back to “mwynhau” when writing to the postcard group and use “joio” when doing SSIW - but if there is something I really enjoy then I’ll use “joio” on postcard too! I’ve noticed there’s the choice of eisiau or moyn for want but I’m sticking with moyn and use eisiau for need as SSIW does.
The only thing that does make me wince regarding other word options is the use of what I call “English-isms” creeping into Welsh - I re-started watching Pobol after a gap of a few years and I’m horrified at how often either English is used now eg “alright” instead of iawn - or a Welsh version of the English word is used - eg recently I heard one of them say going for a “walk” albeit pronounced as “wark” instead of mynd am dro. In those instances I’d stick with the original Welsh. I know some people would say it’s just the language evolving but to me it’s watering it down instead.
Just so you’re aware (if not already - or if someone new is also reading this), that’s the Southern pattern - SSiW North uses eisiau for want and angen for need. But you’re right - stick with what is more common in your area.
The Pobol script writers just reflect what is common in spoken colloquial Welsh - cutting out all the English-isms would be very odd-sounding for a contemporary soap.
hi there- yes I’m in the South yes - I guessed why Pobol is doing it but I think if we all do that then we’re going to keep losing a lot of Welsh- I know others may not agree but I think it’s a shame to replace them with English words.
When I lived in Llandysul, most of the first language Welsh speakers there referred to “mynd am wâk” so I used to adapt my Welsh to say the same when with them, but “mynd am dro” at other times.
I asked a native Welsh speaking colleague once about the liberal sprinkling of English words and what determines when to throw in some English. She said that in her case it’s basically when the English way of saying something is easier/simpler.
I once heard my old boss say “dwi’n absolutely skint” in the middle of a Welsh conversation. I’m guessing that was probably a case of easier/simpler…
Conversely my dad told me he remembers a neighbour who would say “it’s glaw-ing it down”.
I wonder how much goes in the other direction (Welsh words/phrases for English speakers)
I definitely hear the odd borrowed Welsh word. “Have a gweld” is one I’ve heard quite a lot, as is “I haven’t got the mynadd” (which is roughly “I can’t be bothered”). I amuse myself by thinking of that one as “mynydd” instead.
(Now that I’ve been learning Welsh I feel like it should be “have an edrych” but that’s not what people say 🤷🏻)
I’m a native Northern Welsh speaker and I use absolutely everything, depending on how I’m feeling/who I’m talking to/the nature of the conversation/where I am.
For me everything in mostly interchangeable, especially since the arrival of text messaging and social media - language has evolved to have so many faces and so many ‘new’ dialects dependant on age and use.
I use joio/mwynhau/enjoio and when telling someone else to have a good time, I’ll say ‘joia’!
My advice would be to use whatever you feel comfortable using and please don’t be put off by anyone trying to tell you that you are wrong for using one version of a word over another - we are all owners of this language.