Diolch Siaron!
So it‘s just as I thought 
1 Like
Small update. I met a Welsh tutor from Pembroke last week, noticed him saying mee-oown and asked him if it was a Pembrokeshire/south-western thing. He said it was.
3 Likes
In the Vocab List, it’s written as “sha lan” with “(tuag i lan)” given as an alternative
1 Like
In the Old Course L2 Vocabulary lesson 8 we get the expression ‘i fyny grisiau’ for ‘upstairs’. Dw i’n mynd i fyny grisia etc.
But in the examples, the ‘i’ is regularly missed out. Is there a pattern to this? e.g. it’s used when there’s an idea of motion (to go upstairs) and missed out when it’s place (he is upstairs)?
Or is it just sometimes left out in quick normal speech, particularly after a vowel?
Secondly, Aran drops in the phrase “Who’d bring up kids?”, with an answer which sounds like Pwy faga’r plant. Is that the conditional magu → magai fo/hi?
And if it is, is it common to use the ‘short’ conditional (e.g. without byddai) like this in speech?
Thanks!
Yes, because the i here is attached to the mynd, not to the fyny, but also it can sometimes get ‘swallowed up’ in pronounciation to make it sound like it isn’t there between mynd and fyny.
Yes, it is and it’s common in speech (particularly in the north) for -ai to become -a, and for the short form to be used.
2 Likes
Thanks @siaronjames!
It’s sometimes difficult to know when an expression sounds the way it does because of the grammar, or because of the elision, but your answer has cleared that particular one up for me…
Similarly, I’m never really sure whether what sounds like i’w neud o is really i wneud o, because technically, aren’t they – and i neud o – all valid? I don’t suppose it matters much either way…
Thanks again!
yup, all valid in speech and all would be understood as meaning the same thing 
1 Like
Not in this exact context, but I occasionally hear people on Rownd a Rownd saying Be’ ti’n da’ma?! which is translated as “What are you doing here?!” in English subtitles, and that seems to fit with what your tutor said about da chi.
But the etymology of this is a complete conundrum wrapped in a mystery to me.
1 Like
You’ve just answered your own question 
Yes, gweinyddiad and gweinyddiaeth are administration (i.e. the noun), but the adjective administrative (as shortened in admin work) is gweinyddol.
2 Likes
I think it’s that gweinyddiaeth is administration as in a body of people, as in a government or council. gweinyddiad is more as in a ministering or an officiating.
2 Likes
If you’re talking about admin as in paperwork, it’d be gwaith gweinyddol.
For instance, at work we have offices for cynhyrchwyr, suites for golygyddion, and an office for the team gweinyddol.
1 Like
Byddwn I/ fysat ti/ fyddet ti’n etc.
I’m v confused with the later challenges in L2. In my Sylfaen course, we have learnt that ‘would’ is mi faswn i/ faset ti / fasai hi / fasech chi etc, but in ssiw ‘would’ seems to translated in a different way - fyddech chin / fyddet ti ( challenge 18) and byddwn i (c.24). Some, like ‘Fysat ti’ in c.24 don’t seem to appear in any verb conjugation table anywhere . I understand about the SM after Mi, such that Mi faswn i can become Baswn i, but there seem to be so many variations and things like ‘Fysat ti’ that I can’t find anywhere.
I’ve seen the thread on baswn vs taswn vs baswn but that doesn’t shed light on this q.
This confused me too when I first came across it in Level 2. As far as I can tell there are two issues here.
First of all, ‘would’ (the conditional of bod) has two main variants – baswn i / baset ti etc and byddwn i / byddet ti etc – which both mean the same thing. Some regions prefer one, some the other.
Secondly, the difference between baswn i / byddwn i and faswn i and fyddwn i is that Welsh has three ‘forms’ of each tense (I don’t know what the formal word for this is, sorry):
- A positive statement (AFFIRMATIVE): I would…
- A question (INTERROGATIVE): Would I…?
- A NEGATIVE statement: I would not…
For reason to do with mutation, affirmative statements don’t mutate the first letter, so you get baswn i / bydwwn i for I would.
But interrogatives and negatives do mutate the first letter, so you get faswn i…? / fyddwn i…? (Would I…?) and faswn i ddim / byddwn i ddim (I would not).
However, sometimes people put a marker word mi or fe in front of an affirmative statement, and this affirmative marker does force the mutation, so you hear and see fe faswn ni / mi fyddwn i for ‘I would’ – and that’s what you’ve been seeing in your Sylfaen course.
Obviously, the reasons why this happens are a bit more complicated in the detail and there are a couple of wrinkles (e.g. formally I think you’re supposed to use the Aspirate Mutation with the negative, but many people don’t unless the verb begins with c- and often not then), but this is the basic explanation as far as I understand it – I hope the experts will correct any thing I’ve got wrong!
The New Course doesn’t really go into any details of this, because everybody will understand if you mix the 'b’s and 'f’s up anyway, but the Old Course does spend a fair bit of time on it. It’s one of the reasons why people recommend you do the Old Course once you’ve finished Level 2 of the New Course – it covers less ground, but it’s a bit more thorough, so it’s good revision.
3 Likes
There are two ways of conjugating ‘would’ in Welsh. They are both as valid as each other and which you use comes down to personal preference or what you here around you most often.
Having said that, there are also variations that add to the mix making it sound like more than two versions. Again, using these are personal/local preference.
The two basic sets are
Byswn i, byset ti, bysai fo/fe/hi, byswn ni, bysech chi, bysen nhw
and
Byddwn i, byddet ti, byddai fo/fe/hi, byddwn ni, byddech chi, bydden nhw
Then in both cases you sometimes have the positive statement marker mi (N) or fe (S) in front which causes the SM b>f
Then, quite frequently in speech, you will come across the mutation that the marker has caused but the marker itself has dropped off.
Best advice is to stick with whichever way you are used to or prefer, but to be aware of the other ways because the person you’re speaking to may not use the same form as you do.
5 Likes
Shwmae bawb,
Every now and then I’ll feel like I’m doing great with my Welsh, I’ll translate something I’d consider to be quite difficult but then before you know it I’ll forget something ‘basic’ for example I completely forgot what the word for again was in Welsh and forgot that female plural adjectives don’t mutate.
Is this common?
Yes, very common, absolutely normal, and pretty much routine! Don’t worry, you’re not alone!
6 Likes
Ah thank you for the reply. That’s reassuring to know! I’m in good company then
1 Like
Noswaith dda!
I know from SSiW that “ond yw e?” = “doesn’t it?” and “ond yw nhw?” = “don’t they?” (apologies if those spellings are wrong!), but is there a way to say “isn’t it?”, e.g. “that’s nice, isn’t it?”
On a similar note, another thing I feel I’m missing from my Welsh vocabulary is how to start a question “Is it…”, e.g. “Is it raining?”, “Is it on?”, etc. Apologies if this doesn’t have a quick answer…
Diolch!
The tag ond yw e/hi? applies to both isn’t it and doesn’t it, so your example would be
Mae’n neis, ond yw e?
It’s not missing, but you haven’t made the connection yet. You use the same word as in the interrogative tag isn’t it – yw (or ydy):
Statement – Mae hi’n bwrw glaw.
Question – Ydy/yw hi’n bwrw glaw?
1 Like
Ah that makes sense! Thanks for helping me make the connection - my question options are endless now! Diolch yn fawr iawn!