I feel this very keenly, and I am not known for my patience…
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Couldn’t agree more, Frances. The ones who are really not with it never get corrected by a certain type of tutor. This tutor just lets them get on with it and shows no interest in ensuring they have actually understood the work. The tutor just wants to get THEMSELVES through the course. I hate it when I’m made to do group work with this type of student. It is so frustrating. They just sit there umming and ahhing waiting for me to supply them with the answers.
Exactly the description of the tutor in Dysgu byw by Sarah Reynolds,“A light-hearted novel by a new author about a group of people learning Welsh” - it’s a relatively easy read and quite funny (providing, of course, the wounds from a real evening class are not too fresh 
)
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Dysgu byw
Hmmm maybe I’ll read that when I’ve stopped being so pissed off with the actual experience. Actually, expressing my feelings here is helping me realise I’m wasting what little is left of my life going somewhere that gives me a sinking feeling every time I walk through the door.
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Sorry John I meant a personal reply but landed it on the main conversation
OK, I must be the odd one out. I enjoyed my old style Dosbarth Nos Welsh evening classes back in the 90s. Possibly because we had such a good teacher. Even though at the time it wasn’t cool to learn Welsh, I feel that it was because of those classes that I later came to know and love SSiW.
On the other hand, I also enjoyed learning German at school. Again due to a couple of good teachers. OK, so I did poorly at the exam, but nevertheless, I was able to enjoy speaking basic German when on Holiday.
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Yes…
…indeed. Makes all the difference. I had a great teacher for French in my first year of school, and possibly because of that experience (even though all my subsequent French teachers at school were “pretty moderate”), I’ve always had a love of the French language, even if I’m a bit rusty these days.
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I must be the odd one out
There are at least two of us 
and I suspect/hope there are a few more. After a lifetime of teaching and being taught, my own belief/experience is that bad teachers (of Welsh AND Physics) are in the minority.
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Hi Frances. We held our prynhawn coffi this afternoon and it was a lot of fun. If you are still up for the journey to Thornbury next time, I’d encourage you to come along. Again, it will probably be on the last Wednesday of March (27th). Keep an eye on Cornel y Siaradwyr and let me know if you want to ‘brave’ the challenge! I am sure you’ll be made most welcome. The only pre-requisite is that you’ll have to try and join in with ‘Calon Lan’
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Sounds really great! Like the sketch by Rhodri Davies… Someone posted a link to that somewhere on the forum I might look for it later. It’s so funny honestly__
Yes I’ve had an experience like that to do with something, not an evening class though another kind of social group which I feel I won’t be attending again. Life is too short focus on what brings you joy happiness and a little light to the world
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Yes thank you I would like to come but please can you tell me what you mean by Keep an eye on cornel y sairadwyr, Is that the name of the group? Sorry if you’ve already told me this I’m little bit confused these days. Now I don’t wish to add insult to injury ( If I do it’s meant with love ) but I seem to recall that we were made to sing or were going to be made to sing a song with that name in the evening class with the presumption that we all knew what it was and what it was about. Now I’m afraid I may be very ignorant but I don’t… Is that the Welsh National anthem? I think it was the presumption that we already knew lots of stuff like that put me off this evening class because obviously I felt like I’d been living in a hole for my entire life whereas I haven’t, I promise it’s just that I’m English and although I love Wales I haven’t been brought up knowing what the favourite national Welsh songs are. I’m also not a fan of rugby again please don’t shoot me and so probably wouldn’t have heard it there either… With such a high level of ignorance on my part (Self depreciating wink) Would you still want me to attend your group? Seriously though it sounds great and if I can I will come along because it’s really helpful to hear people speaking Welsh, and will inspire me to do so myself.
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As I recall, Hi-fi had just been invented, so I spent my evenings listening to German radio instead of doing my homework 
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Teaching is everything isn’t it. I have had relatively few really good teachers in my life. One of the best I had was two lecturers at University, Both of whom were intelligent encouraging and able to give constructive criticism am in a way that didn’t make you feel bad about yourself. With both of these tutors there was a high level of mutual respect between us and they were only too willing to give their time to help. If I hadn’t had such good tutors I probably wouldn’t have got a first in my degree. It really makes all the difference which is why I get annoyed when I say lazy tutors, In Particular when working with adults because then they don’t have the bad behaviour aspect to deal with as well so really they have no excuse not to make sure that their paying students are getting their money’s worth. Anyway I’m really pleased you had positive experiences with language teaching at school. My best subject at school was Latin which I would’ve taken on and done O-level except that I had to leave school due to some personal problems and then ended up taking qualifications later on in life. I’ve normally found that I am the best person to teach myself anything, as I know my own learning style and can become very anxious and discouraged if I think that I’m getting left behind in class. Anyway I better go now because actually I want to do some say something in Welsh and here I am just posting on the forum! Hywel!
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Frances, I post details about our coffee group under Cornel y Siaradwyr in the meetups/events section. Hopefully this link will take you there.
As for the singing, it’s not compulsory by any means! I’m English too, not a drop of Welsh blood to be found, but I too love Wales in the way that you do, which is what inspired me to learn the language. I was aware of the song ‘Calon Lan’ I suppose, (no it’s not the national anthem!), but didn’t know it at all until one day about 18 months ago, before I really started learning Welsh, a couple of Welsh learners/speakers invited me to join them in a rendition of it while we were attending a harmony singing weekend (nothing to do with Wales). We had a little cabaret on the Saturday evening. So, knowing a teeny bit of Welsh, I learnt the first verse and chorus and off we went. If you ever go on a SSIW ‘bwtcamp’, I’m sure you’ll hear it sung - probably in many different forms! Just have a listen on youtube and try it out perhaps. You’ll be able to ‘mouth along’ anyway if you don’t know the words. We don’t do a lot of singing in the group, just a bit of fun at the end.
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It’s obviously a very popular welsh song! What’s it about? I know calon is heart. I’m a singer, so no issues with singing as long as I’m not presumed to know it already! Ok thanks a lot for the information take care And hopefully see you in Thornbury sometime
I certainly don’t know the words either, although I know the tune. I can manage the 1st line of the chorus though:
Calon lân yn llawn daioni,
Love that word “daioni” which the Wikipedia entry translates as “virtue”, but you could think of it as “goodness” (cf. “da” = “good”, of course).
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Thanks for your interesting response, Frances. Since my reply is long and mainly of interest to you and me, I’ve sent it by Private Message
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So is that what they sung at the rugby wales v england last week? Or was that land of my fathers another one I was assumed to know. Anyway thanks for sharing, I have got a lot of enjoyment from looking at distant dreamer’s youtube channel where he/she gave translations from welsh and the original lyrics of songs, I have learned a lot of words from that, though a lot of it is just impossible at this stage for me, but the songs are fab and I love some of the more strident nationalist songs, it gives me an insight into Welsh culture that I didn’t have before.
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