I get confused sometimes about The Disappearing Bod. Example - in Level 2, Challenge 11 we have ‘We all thought that they should find a better way.’ Iestyn says ‘O’n ni’n i gyd yn meddwl dylen nhw ffeindio ffordd well.’ No problem - but where’s ‘that’ gone?
1 Like
Posing as I am interested in the answer too!
“The Disappearing Bod” is something that happens quite frequently in the spoken form (which is, after all, what the SSiW phrases are).
In the example you give, the written form would be something like:
Roedden ni’n i gyd yn meddwl a dylen nhw ffeindio ffordd well.
As you can see, the ‘bods’ are different - O’n ni’n has come from Roedden ni’n and there is an extra ‘a’ with the verb dylen.
The ‘a’ before dylen is actually the missing ‘that’. In spoken form it is often implied rather than stated. Actually, the same thing happens in English, we just don’t usually pick up on it e.g. spoken form: “I didn’t know you supported Wrexham FC” vs fully formal form: “I didn’t know that you supported Wrexham FC”
4 Likes
y dylen nhw? 
2 Likes
Yes - y dylen nhw that they ought to
The a particle is the relative (i.e. who, which, etc), the y particle is the subordinate (i.e. reported speech, etc) , so:
Dyma’r ddynes a fydd yn siarad neithiwr
Here’s the woman WHO will be speaking tonight
Dw i’n meddwl y bydd y ddynes yn hwyr
I think THAT the woman will be late
3 Likes
So in answer to @CaerlanChris 's query - you DON’T use bod when the verb after the ‘that’ is NOT the verb bod, you use y instead.
5 Likes
Really, really helpful. Thanks all.
oops 
, yes y, not a - a is to do with a different thing (thank you Gareth!) and I still get them muddled up 
. Just as well they’re left out in speech, really! 
edit to say - wow - you lot answered quick in the meantime!
3 Likes
I have copied and pasted this from another thread which discussed the variants of ‘that’…
…it is a synopsis of what some chap called Gareth King put in the introduction to his Modern Welsh Dictionary - in the introduction covering grammar (not the reference section) - the further brutal summary being:
Original idea begins with:
Present tense: use bod
Pretorite past tense: use ‘i’
A verb representing any other tense e.g. byddwn or dylech etc: use ‘y’
No verb at start - because sentence re-arranged for emphasis: use taw or mai
Simples!
5 Likes
Very good point Siaron 
1 Like
How…I mean HOW does he do it??!
2 Likes
Sorry to be ignorant but what is the preterite tense please? I did do Latin many years ago but don’t remember any tense being called that… Thanks.
1 Like
Not ignorant at all…everyday is a school day for me and long may it continue:-) …it is for completed action in the past Eg I ran, I saw, I phoned
There are a few ways of forming it…
eg by adding endings to the stem of the verb
Eg Ffoni-es I for I phoned
Ffoniest ti for you phoned
…or by saying ‘I did’ phone…nes I fonio…etc…or in the north using ddaru mi fonio, ddaru ti fonio - ddaru indicating the past tense.
Rich
2 Likes
That’s because the Latin verb-system didn’t have a preterite. Greek and Sanskrit did - it’s the aorist - but not Latin.
Bloody Romans…
5 Likes
Bloody Romans…
Yeah. What did they ever do for us? 
7 Likes
I knew someone here could be depended upon. And it was you, Huw!
4 Likes
Thank you. Understanding at last!
Anne
2 Likes
With L.o.B having such strong Aberystwyth connections, I felt it was my duty. 
2 Likes