Tiny questions with quick answers - continuing thread

Your radar is working very well! You could have ‘Aderyn yw’r robin goch’ or ‘Mae’r robin goch yn aderyn’, or ‘Yw’r aderyn yn robin goch?’ if you wanted to ask about it… :sunny:

2 Likes

Diolch, Aran, that helps a lot!

1 Like

Hello! :blush: I hope I’m using this correctly, this is my first post.
My “tiny question” is whether there is some sort of rule that tells me which words happen to be immutable even though they start with a consonant that normally mutates (e.g. soft mutation for mynd -> fynd, but not moyn -> foyn). Do I just have to learn that by heart?

Thanks in advance :slight_smile:
Astrid

(Also sorry if this has been discussed elsewhere, I did try to find something via the search option.)

2 Likes

Croeso i’r fforwm Asteroid.

I’m not personally aware of any rule.

However, from my occasional reading of Gareth King’s “Modern Welsh: A Comprehensive Grammar”, he does talk about some words “resisting mutation”, as he puts it.

I imagine it’s a case of just noticing them as they occur, because they are probably not numerous enough to worry about.

After a while, your ear will tell you whether it’s right or not because you will have heard it so many times.

(Just did a google and apparently “byth” is one word that “resists mutation” ).

(diolch byth! :slight_smile: ).

M.

1 Like

Yup, afraid so - there are just a small number of words that don’t change - in the case of ‘moyn’, because (apparently) it originally comes from ‘ymofyn’ - but there aren’t all that many of them… :sunny:

And a very warm welcome to the forum! :star:

2 Likes

Diolch yn fawr, @mikeellwood and @aran ! :blush:
I think I’ll manage to cope but maybe I’ll have a look at that grammar book once I know a bit more Welsh. :slight_smile:

2 Likes

Okay, quick translation question. Does this work or does it sound stilted or just wrong?

Llongyfarchiadau a dymuniadau gorau i chi ddau. Cadw’n dawnsio!

Cadw doesn’t translate all the meanings of ‘keep’, I’m afraid - so you’ll want something like ‘Daliwch ati i ddawnsio’ or ‘Mwynhewch y ddawns’ ayyb… :slight_smile:

1 Like

To @aran A while back I mentioned ewythyr meaning Uncle and was told it is terribly old fashioned and one of the words only aged folk like me would understand. Yesterday I was watching S4C with my little dog and saw the end of a program where a bachgen ifanc posts a letter thanking for a present. Later we got to see the envelope, clearly addressed to “Ewythyr Sion”. So has it come back into fashion???

No, not really (unfortunately) - but whoever told you that only old people would understand it was over-cooking it somewhat - I’m sure there are people who wouldn’t be familiar with it, but I know plenty of people who understand it fine, even if they don’t use it… :sunny:

My new favourite online dictionary, Gweiadur.com gives 3 possibles:

uncle noun dewyrth masculine, ewa masculine, ewythr masculine

http://www.gweiadur.com/en/Pawb/$uncle

(You have to register, but once registered it’s very good).

http://geiriadur.bangor.ac.uk/#uncle&sln=en gives it as the only option, with 2 plurals:

ewythr ( ewythrod, ewythredd )

and so does http://www.geiriadur.net (only giving ewythredd as the plural)

1 Like

Thanks!! I see I spelled it wrong… I remembered the sound not the look!! I don’t actually have any living ewythredd… they’d have to be pretty old… but it’s nice to know that the word I’d naturally use would be understood!!

Would anyone have a Welsh exclamation equivalent to English ‘blast’ or ‘rats’? A friend (actually a friend, not just me using a writer’s euphemism!) has a Welsh character in one of her stories who is in need of a word to use when a rock thrown at a pesky cat misses.
Diolch yn fawr!
Myf

I have a book of idioms and it says Go drapia! for Drat it!. It is also used in L5 of Level 1 in the first listening exercise for the North (but he mutates it Go ddrapia!). In the South version Iestyn uses O daro!.

1 Like

I had been going to suggest “ych a fi” which I thought meant something like “woe is me”. However, I’ve seen translations like “yuck” or “ugh!” on the web, which don’t quite match. I’ve also seen it suggested that it’s quite rude (i.e. tasteless).

I have an app called “Cymraeg i’r Teulu” which gives a preview of the first three units of the course. It teaches “ych-a-fi” as “yuck” in the unit that deals with food. I wouldn’t think it’s terribly rude if it’s in a course for parents and children :slight_smile:

Of course, it’s possible it might be used in other ways with different connotations…I’m not a fluent or native speaker, so I don’t know!

I think that’s actually “ach a fi”, but I could be wrong!! My very respectable Methodist ‘Auntie’ always said it in situations like the one @myfanwya describes, not that she’d ever have thrown anything at a cat! Substitute ‘mouse’ or ‘rat’ and she would certainly have said 'Ach a fi!" if she missed!! (n.b. she wasn’t actually a speaker of Cymraeg, she just lived all her life in Abertawe and Caernarfon!!)

1 Like

I’d go for ‘Go ddrapia!’ here - about as innocent as it gets… :sunny:

Like a lot of Welsh, there seems to be some variation in the pronunciation, and spelling.
e.g.
http://www.theanswerbank.co.uk/Phrases-and-Sayings/Question103929.html

I learned it from my father-in-law, who was English, but had lived in Wales and learned a lot of Welsh. I think he pronounced it “ach”.

Silly one really - I just can’t seem to say “rhywbeth” properly ( excuse spelling, I am trying to not do any reading, while I do the lessons ). The best I can come up with is “roobeth”, despite loads of practice, which sounds nothing like Iestyn and Kat ( again, excuse spelling if not correct ) and now I am so worried/focussing about how to say it, I can’t get my sentence finished before the time is up if that is one of the words needed. Do I say “roobeth” and get on with the lessons and worry about the pronunciation at a later date, or work harder on the word so I am not getting into bad habits ?