Tiny questions with quick answers - continuing thread

Perfect @aran - I will very definitely need that one! Diolch i ti!

1 Like

I have a notion that imp works in both languages, but maybe it’s borrowed! @aran is it OK?

1 Like

No, ‘imp’ is English.

I also read in a Manon Steffan Ros book:

Fy ngwas.

It translates as “my servant” but it’s a term of affection (in this context Nain to ŵyr)

2 Likes

My imps are.

1 Like

saw one recently in a book extract:

if I remember correctly

bwllfynn (a)

related to pwllf meaning more or less “fat lump” meant affectionately (!) . in the e.g. I saw it was addressed to a baby.

1 Like

Thank you both @henddraig and @JohnYoung
That’s really helpful, hopefully i can go through the lesson much better now

Diolch yn fawr! :smile:

1 Like

Quick question: challenge 14 level 1, the phrase “She said that she wanted…” is translated as “Dwedodd hi bod hi’n moyn…”
But isn’t “bod hi’n moyn” present tense? Or am I hearing it incorrectly?
Diolch ymlaen llaw!

1 Like

You’re hearing it perfectly, and getting exposed to a way in which Welsh differs from English…

In English, ‘she said that she wanted’ and ‘she said that she wants’ are two different things - in Welsh, they’re not… :slight_smile:

2 Likes

Or, alternatively - ‘bod’ is a verb-noun, doing the job of an infinitive. So Welsh says “She said herself to be wanting”, which means that the verb in the second clause (“to be”) just isn’t marked for time at all – it could be present ("…that she wants"), or it could be past ("…that she wanted"), but it’s really neither (or both!).

6 Likes

I love that! It’s so poetic. Also confusing, but poetic wins hands down.

I like to wonder how language influences culture and the other way around. If a way of saying can be either past or present AND both, like you explained, I wonder how time was experienced by the pre-industrial Welsh people. It’s ultra-linear in modern times, with our schedules and goals and what have you, and that’s reflected in our languages as well. Anyway… diolch yn fawr, I love learning how Welsh is built up!

1 Like

Sunrise, midday, sunset - without clocks, what else is there? The sundial on the wall round the church may, if the sun was shining, have marked time, but you had to be there to see it!

1 Like

Actually, that’s something I’ve been noticing in English lately - that we say things in a rather convoluted and indirect way. For example, starting a message with something like “I wanted to tell you that …” when what you really are saying is “I want to tell you that …” So I have been trying to be more direct when I write. Note the word TRYING!

2 Likes

Quite - because the bod is a verbnoun, and therefore neutral as to tense. :slight_smile:

1 Like

I was trying to talk about subjective perception of time, not time measurement. :slight_smile: For example, one aspect of linear time perception is that completing a task before a deadline is the most important moment of that task. In a cyclical perception of time, the focus is more on doing it right and maintaining harmony, where the deadline is not a fixed but flexible target. Linear time perception’s sole focus is on the passing of time, cyclical time perception will cheerfully ignore the passing of time if a good conversation isn’t finished yet.

Another example that I love is the difference between “where” our past and our future is. Most westerners, when they visualize the future, it is in front of them - the space between us and the horizon as a virtual time line. In Madagascar for example, the future flows into the back of your head from behind. What they know is what happened in the past, so in their virtual space that is in front of them, where they can “see” it, but the future is unknown and therefore behind you, a virtual space that our senses can tell us in much less detail about.

So with Welsh creating sentences that can be either present or past, or both, or neither, I wonder whether Welsh time perception was cyclical in pre-industrial times.

4 Likes

That is a realy interesting observation, particularly the differentiation between linear time and cyclical time. I’m going to have to think about that for a while, but thanks!

2 Likes

That’s a really interesting way to look at it :slight_smile: like @Sionned I will need more time to think about this.

1 Like

Snap!

1 Like

How sensible to have your past where you can see it and your future where you cannot!

5 Likes

@Sionned and @AnthonyCusack, let me know your thoughts! I’m not at all familiar with Welsh folklore, but an indication of cyclical time perception would be the focus on recurring events, which is obvious in an agricultural society (with agricultural heydays as themes as well as events, harvest in particular I suppose) but also in the way ancestors and children are regarded. Many cyclical societies have great reverence for their ancestors, will involve their memories and spirits in their daily lives, but will also be very aware of their responsibility to maintain harmony in a world that their children will inherit. They think less in beginnings and ends, and more in recurring events that may or may not include or involve themselves but will always involve family.

1 Like