There is this. It does sometimes feel as if the target market is the retired.
The last class I was on had a large proportion of fully employed people on it, who had to all make a tremendous effort to get to the class regularly, during the week day.
I mention this because it is unusual.
The people running the courses seem very eager to close them down if there aren’t enough people, seemingly expecting anybody doing one classes at one time will be perfectly able to do another - and that is obviously not true, unless you have no other commitments.
And yes, I understand about money to pay for tutors.
From what I’ve seen, there is a definite “breaking the ice” element to it. The first time is very very difficult to just let yourself go and start speaking dreadful Welsh in a ‘normal’ situation - but once done, the next occasions are completely different. Easier in kind rather than degree.
Unfortunately some people go for years without making that first step- or even never make it.
Yes, it is important for such people to be encouraged to make that first step, probably the most important step in the journey of language learning/speaking.
Again, I have no idea if this is common - but the class I’m enrolled on is mostly English people from the same workplace. Which suggests that maybe Coleg Gwent has minimum expectations for staff to speak Welsh (this is just speculation…). Which in turn might suggest that it is more important to have a piece of paper to wave than working and expanding vocabulary.
Incidentally, there is one chap on the course who has completed and passed it already and is very confident in reading and speaking the basic phrases. Which is a bit unnerving for those of us who couldn’t say anything before the class - I’m not sure why one would want to do the whole thing again unless it is just for practising and is at a convenient time.
I have read that there is a conversation cafe locally at a different location. So it might be worth seeing if there are other local opportunities to chat in Welsh outside of the classes and the welshforadults centre.
Re- people not speaking. I do not give the impression of being shy or backward at coming forward, but at my first Star Trek convention, knowing only one other person, I was extremely quiet.
And in a language one knows one does not speak well, it is even harder. I spoke French in France based only on 47% for O-level because I was literally the only one in our group who knew any! It did wonders for my French! But I’m not sure it helps anyone learning Welsh, because nearly everyone who speaks it can speak English! Mix only with very young children and very elderly folk who have ‘lost’ their English!
You will find that an awful lot of Welsh speakers are quite happy to speak Welsh with learners.
It’s important that people take on the attitude that it is ok to speak less fluent Welsh with Welsh speakers - no need to stick to young children!
Yes, it would be easier in an area where nobody spoke English, but that simply means it is not quite as easy in an area where everyone does, it is nowhere even near to bring impossible!
It’s very important that people have the “get out and use it” attitude. Very important.
Some people pick up that attitude easily, others not so much, but everyone can get it and it should be encouraged by everybody! Good advice from petermescall!
I think that’s pretty much the case for any “voluntary” language learning scheme. (By voluntary, I mean evening-class type, not academically required.) I see the same thing in Spain, where adults, full of initial enthusiasm, fall away from classes or otherwise do not continue a course to the end.
[quote=“henddraig, post:52, topic:6072, full:true”]
Re- people not speaking. I do not give the impression of being shy or backward at coming forward, but at my first Star Trek convention, knowing only one other person, I was extremely quiet.
Diolch yn fawr iawn for the nudge today to pop along to the adult classes. This has been a great night for me, but the tutor didn’t think i was right for canolradd.
when i turned up he wasn’t expecting me and the class had started already. I had contacted lots of people in welsh for adults and was told the class was on and just to turn up and the tutor would assess my level and suggeat which course to go on.
He set the class a task and brought me the sylfaen book and said to look through it and see how much i was comfortable with and he was initially a bit worried that i hadn’t been on the other levels before.
He told me the classes were almost totally in Welsh at this level and wanted to see if I was comfortable. I somehow broke into Welsh then and said fi’n gwbod lot o bethau yn Gymraeg ond sai’n gwybod shwd i sgwrsio yn gymraeg and it just carried on from there. Ten minutes lated all in welsh and totally forgetting about English he said I’d find the course rhwystredig iawn and said lots of things including rhugl, and lots of uwchs and i, ll have to email him tomorrow for siawns i sgwrsio. It was the most natural conversation i have ever had in Welsh as natural as speaking in English and I don’t know where it came from except to say diolch o waelod o’n nghalon i pawb at SSIW. The tutor even sounded like Iestyn, the only thing missing was the lovely Cat. You can probably tell I’m thrilled so Diolch Aran, a lifetime wish of mine has been achieved. I genuinely think he thought I was a welsh speaker and was a bit confused why i was there.
In cloud nine for not being allowed on a course diolch eto.
lots of typos I’m afraid my phone keyboard skills are sadly lacking
Sai’n gwybod. A great ten minutes doesn’t end the quest. I will still fumble and mumble and forget what to say again in future but I have at least felt what it can be like. I still have the vocabulary of five year old with a few political terms thrown in for good measure. So its now down to chatting more I gurss, but the extra confidence is going to help a lot. Sorry it might have come across az a bit full of myaelf, I was just feeling a bit happpy about it and can’t really explain why.
I do that with English all the time. The thing is, you know that you can do it now, so it’ll get easier as you get less nervous about it.
There are other sources of vocabulary - Radio Cymru works if you have the patience. Unfortunately, there’s not a great deal of Welsh language media other than soaps (I hate soaps, and I don’t have the willpower to make myself watch them just to pick up language) - one thing I’ve heard of being done is watching stuff with subtitles, so you know basically what’s being said, and then watching it without. It works best in a language with lots of easily accessible media, but it can work for Welsh too, provided you can find something you find interesting to watch (which is hard for me - there’s very little on S4C that I would ever actually watch for its own sake).
I read in one of your posts from yesterday that you thought you sounded full of yourself. I highly doubt anyone who read them would have thought that. It’s important to celebrate your successes and feel proud when you feel like you’ve achieved something, and we’ve all posted about our little victories as they have happened along the way. So the next time you feel elated after an experience yn y Gymraeg, don’t worry about how the rest of us will perceive it - we’ll be celebrating with you.
diolch to you and Karla, I seemed to have lost some of my normal inhibitions and was in a strange shout it from the rooftops sort of mood. It’s just that when I fell back to planet earth and got a bit of perspective on things I started to get a bit embarrassed about my very public display of excitement. I’m naturally pretty reserved and broke quite a few lifetime habits yesterday.
I remember feeling the same way when I first started having conversations.
And I remember clearly feeling and sharing the excitement that my partner showed when she came back from having her first long conversation in Welsh in a ‘natural’ setting.
It’s an emotional thing. There’s a lot invested into this language with a lot of us- not just time and effort, but the strong emotional connection we have with it.
Things like that can really hit you hard - in a good way!
In not surprised you felt excited.
That’s a good thing.
