Verbs that dont have 'n prefix

Is there a list or table giving verbs like eisiau that drop the n please.

Not that I’m aware of - but there aren’t many of them, so don’t worry too much about it!

Eisiau, angen, that might be about it!.. :sunny:

Sometimes moyn in the south but only because people are using it like eisiau. Otherwise, Aran is right, I think.

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The only other one I can think of is dal when it means “still”:

Dw i dal isio siarad “I still want to speak”

Though in its other meanings, dal always has the yn, e.g. Dw i’n dal y bws “I’m catching the bus”.

(You could also argue that dal “still” is more of an adverb than a verb… but I won’t get into grammary stuff :smile: )


Ohhh … my list of them is long one!


But yes, on the sirious matter … thank you for clearing things up. My life will become easier now knowing this.


I was told that the linking 'yn, goes between the part of ‘bod’ and the verb. The reason you don’t have ‘yn’ between ‘bod’ and eisiau/angen/etc is that they are nouns and not verbs.
Is this an absolute rule or are there exceptions? However, it does apply to eisiau and angen.

Well, it’s a rule, but there are very few nouns which have come to be used like verbs in that particular way! Eisiau and angen as you say, moyn (a verb) sometimes follows if you want, possibly due to following eisiau, as RobertBruce says but not necessarily, as does dal (what kinetic said) sometimes when meaning need but not necessarily- but there aren’t enough of these things to have a general rule, really, I would have thought.

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This is a grammar-geek aside, but… if we’re talking about parts of speech, then I’ve always personally considered isio and angen to be prepositions, not nouns. Yes, they derive from nouns, but they behave exactly like prepositions. Prepositional phrases also follow bod without an yn - e.g. dw i ar y ffordd, mae o mewn trwbl. Compare: dw i isio siarad vs. dw i am siarad, both meaning “I want to speak”. See what I mean?

And they behave the same in other tenses too: for example, if you put dw i ar y ffordd into the perfect, you get dw i wedi bod ar y ffordd. And with isio it’s the same: dw i wedi bod isio siarad (and not *dw i wedi isio siarad).


That is a really helpful way of looking at it, Kinetic - ta v. v. much.

Thank you for that. I have printed these responses out to put into my Welsh grammar book!

My advice is not to get into lists or tables here. As our fellow posters have pointed out, there are few ‘verbs’ that make up that list. ‘Yn’ has many alternatives, depending on what you want to say, like wedi, dal, ar fin, newydd, am, heb - think of eisiau and angen as two more. These are all link words that are used with bod and a verb noun (to use Gareth King’s terminology)
Anyway, that is my simple take on this.

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