Old lessons vs new lessons

Welsh General / Questions
#1

Hello. That’s a long time I did not come here and I’m happy to come back.
In fact, I gave up with SSIW because I was not at all at my ease with the vocabulary. I found:it was very axed around yoursel, beginner, and the way you want to speak, you try to speak, you would have liked to speak, you shoudl speak, you have been speaking, etc (more temps again when you’re not even at lesson 5) but… youre still unabbble to say Hello to the fisrt welsh people you’ll meet and tell him or her if you prefer coffee or beer, or if you eat meat or not. The thing you’re everyday recalled is how you’ll impress your welsh auditory.

So I decided to mix SSIW with BBC Wales lessons, and at last I was in the real life, more affective, more friendly; less turning around myself and my impressive capacities to speak welsh and impress my auditory according having begun so few time ago (excuse me for this very bad english).

Then someone talked to me of SSIW “old lessons”. , and they indeed are much closer to what I like : yet, Aran presents himself, says his name and wife’s name Catryn, the differences between their 2 ways of pronouncing, etc. Also : he explains immediatly that in welsh the english present-present (I go) and the progressive present (I’m: going) are the same, so you immediatly understant that to say “I’m going” you use exactly the same way that ffor “I go”. In lesson 1 “new lessons” I was wondering about that : why “I am going” was the same that “I go”; no explaination). Well, and other examples.

You may also from this very first lesson, speak with someone and ask him or her about him or her, because you leran the “you” (well I would have liked both" ti" and “chi”, but nobody is perfect). Once more, it’s more friendly to ask people about themselves than always turning around your own person.

Voilà. It’s just my opinion, but I give it just in case it would help, because I remember someone (apart from me) lamenting a bit about the type of vocabulary a bit “out of real life”.
Ah, and just a last reason for me to prefer the new lessons : the jingle at the beginning, is less agressive. From another side, sure that the very first note of the song in new lessons will awake you if you’re still a bit dreamy; it may be nice too, but I prefer the neutral (and short) little notes beginning the old lessons. Well, that’s probably very subjective.

So I suppose there was good reasons for changing the axe of the vocabullary and give les explainations, but what I hope is that old lessons would be available on the site a long time !
Hwyl !
.(and please do forgive the typing errors if let, in addition to my incorrect english)

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#2

I did the old lessons years ago but didn’t keep at it. I like the new lessons but I admit the only thing missing is being able to start a conversation. I did do 6.1 of the old lessons to learn a bit more of the conversation starters. It’s interesting to know the difference between the two and I was tempted to do the old course again but I’m not sure if I need to.

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#3

Yes, in fact, when I say “Old lessons vs new lesson”, it’ would be better said “in addition with” more than “versus”… Both have their reasons to be, and could satisfy one or another learner… What I would like to know is : why did it change till that point (speaking about vocabulary).

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#4

One of the best things about having several options to choose from to learn a language today is that everyone can pretty much find the most suitable for them.
And one of the most interesting things for me is reading learners opinions on the web about their experience that can be very different from my point of view and make me think!

So, first of all, thanks for sharing your experience, @mcbrittany.

One part that was particularly interesting to read for me is:

I studied English at school the traditional way - therefore all the “how do you do”, “how are you”, “good evening” “pleased to meet you”, “where can I find a restaurant” “I would like to order” and so on.
First time I went to England, after 7 years of courses, that was pretty much all I was able to say. I was people had a hard time understanding what I said and I was definitely unable to have a conversation, because I was so slow at putting together words into sentences with “uhm” and totally sounded just like an Italian learner.

I went to Wales recently, about a year since I’ve started studying it basically with SSiW with the new course only and more than one people referred to me as fluent. Of course I always look at them as they were crazy. :sweat_smile:
But what I notice myself is that what I learnt with SSiW - even though I make a lot of mistakes, forget mutations and articles and mess up sentences structures at times, I’m sure - really allows me to speak with people.

For the touristy and basic sentences, and the extra vocabulary, I’ve just looked up a bit around the web or took note of things I’ve heard on S4C. Or use the dictionary app. Or sneak in an English word. Or just ask people I’m speaking to what’s the Welsh for whatever word I need - and after 3 or 4 times I often even remember it from then on, much more easily.

So those phrases that just pop up in my head in @Iestyn and Cath voice (or other times Dave Datblygu’s voice :rofl: are really what I needed more to communicate faster and more efficiently than learning from any course I’ve ever done before!
BTW also thanking @aran, @CatrinLliarJones and @Deborah-SSi of course, since I’m here.

(just to share one experience, that doesn’t mean to contradict others in any way).

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#5

Oh yes Gisella I agree with youconcernig the fact that" tourists sentences" might be said once you’re in the country, and even, I would say : you don’t even need words : you just have to xhow the coffee or the tea to idnicatte that’s your choice, you may move youtrhand to say hello; show a part of your body and make a bad face to show it’s hurting you, show your watch (oh non, that was in the old times…) to ask what time is it… Of course. Plenty of wordds are useless in fact, are they “tuouristical” or not, when you ca replace them by a gest.
What I was jusst trying to say concerning the new lessons, is that I miss “human warmth”. Begin a course with “I want” is a bit strange for me… But of course, as you say, it is nice to read the feeling of different persons, and I suppose that thoses “new lessons” have been made because they match better with what is supposed to be expected by a great majority (I’m always apart from the majorities, that’s my problem :laughing:. ) They just don’t fit me; but the old ones yes. I Thanks for your answer, anyway. Have a nice sunday.

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#6

I think I misunderstood this post the first time I read it. I know what you mean, learning Welsh at school it’s very robotic but with SSIW you learn how to speak and say things properly.

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#7

Ok, I understand what you mean. Reading this, I guess one thing that may have influenced my different feelings about the new course is that I don’t really think of them as sentences I’m supposed to use as they are - although it may frequantly happen.

I see them more as, often hilarious and slightly absurd, containers from which I can extrapolate structures, pronunciation and grammar rules of Welsh language without needing to study the theory - that for me is always boring and confusing, at least in early stages of language learning.
While you seem to appreciate instead, which is probably another good reason for you to enjoy the old course if there’s more of those.

But it’s all good, as long as we keep on learning each in their own favourite way, isn’t it?
Have a nice Sunday afternoon and evening! :smiley:

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#8

Oh yes I agree with you concerning the funny absurdity of somes sentences, and as you, I don’t take them as “sentences” but just as exercices to pracitce “combinations of words”. It’s the same with the old lessons. So no, I’m not criticizing the method in itself; just, as already said, a “centralisation” on the learner, what he-she is abble to do, and how proud he-she has to be. What I apreciate in the old lessons is that “the other” ( = “you”) is concerned, so you may really converse with somebody and not only talk about yourself, yourself, and yourself again…
Well, I’ve saitd al this in my first post, so I’m not going to say it again. But it was interesting exchange with you, thankyou Gisella. Diolch.

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#9

Oh it’s actually a friendly cloudy-Sunday chat - I didn’t mean to make you feel compelled to go on further or repeat what you’ve already said. Diolch for answering!

However, I think there’s plenty of sentences about “you” (ti/chi) also in the new course, so I admit I hadn’t completely understood this point of yours.

Oh, but thing is: by the time you get to he/she and them and talking in the tavern with all those people who know your sister and work with your brother, and find out everything about your interlocutor’s young and grown-up children…you’re so going to miss those early self-centered lessons! :smiley:

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#10

:laughing: No prolblem at all, Gisella, I it was interesting exchangge views. Human nature is, luckily, rich of different ways of feeling things, and when those differences are gently exposed, it’s nice; And so it was, no problem at all.
Here it’s raining too, but I like rain. Mae hi’n bwrw glaw ! In breton : “Glav a ra” (same pronounciation for “glav” that for “glaw”)
Hwyl !

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#11

I like rain too, besides sun, just not necessarily standing outside all the time these days. :grin:
By the way, I love Brittany as well (and accidentally was talking about it and Wales just yesterday with a friend). Been there several times, and got curious about the language although I ended up choosing to learn the one of a place where I had never been!
But it’s very interesting for me to hear similarities so maybe I find it easier to understand it next time!

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#12

:laughing: Concerning celtic countries, I went to Ireland, and Scotland; and never to Wales, and yet I chose learning welsh. and not gaelic.
Cornish would be closer to Breton than Welsh, but alas, no way to communicate directly by using each orther our own tongue : they are too far one from the other, even if we believe, seeing a lot of common words, that we could communicate…

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