There is also the fact that the north Walian English accent is a lot gentler than (English) people may imagine, having in mind the stereotypical Welsh accent they may have heard on the radio (e.g. Leadin’ Seaman Goldstein (Tenniel Evans) of The Navy Lark , for those of a certain age*, or perhaps Max Boyce for the slightly younger ones), which is actually South Walian. This is something I learned from my wife who spent formative years in North Wales. When I would occasionally do a “comedy Welsh accent” at home (years before ever attempting to learn the lingo properly), she would say (rather sniffily) “yes well, that’s a South Wales accent because that’s all you’ve heard, but they don’t speak like that in the north…”. (collapse of stout party).
There is also that of course.
*(I’m also old enough to remember Gladys Morgan from Worker’s Playtime. She was very good too)._
I find that whenever I go on holiday people don’t believe that I have lived in Wales all my life because I don’t sound Welsh at all . Apparently I have some sort of accent but they can’t tell what it is which is slightly worrying .
My accent has gone over the years - twenty years studying and living in England did that. When I first went to university no-one could understand a word I was saying and I had to adapt a bit which is a shame now looking back.[quote=“mikeellwood, post:21, topic:5691”]
north Walian English accent is a lot gentler than (English) people may imagine
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Well we always used to mimic Gogs by talking through our noses, but when I hear people speaking Welsh from North Wales now it doesn’t seeem half as nasal as I remember it to be.
It’s scary how quickly accents get diluted. I recently met an English northerner who on discovering I was from De Cymru said: ‘Oh, I thought your accent had a bit of a twang!’ To which I replied: ‘I would certainly hope for more than a twang!’
That said, I find returning home for a few days often tops up my accent nicely
I haven’t lived in South Wales for almost 20 years - everyone I know where I live now says I sound very welsh - at home they accuse me of sounding English!
Reading this as a completely non-Welsh “outsider” I really understand you. But I wouldn’t get too frustrated. It would be much more positive to concentrate on what you are doing: learning your native language and contributing to a forum dedicated to spreading the use of Cymraeg. If you’re serious about it then yes, it will sometimes require a big effort.
A great teacher of mine once told me, when I was in a group of very ideologically-motivated youth, that you can’t change the world - so don’t try - but that you can do your best to influence those around you. That’s where you have a much better chance of success.
You are far from a welsh outsider - you have visited our lovely country and have spoken welsh whilst here - to me that makes you a part of our great community.
As part of my efforts I have organised a mini bootcamp weekend - I am greatly looking forward to it.
And tomorrow is a chat session with a local group.
I get that kind of response a lot about my accent. I live in the American Midwest, but I don’t feel particularly connected to it, nor does my accent seem to reflect it. Sometimes I have to make myself sound more American on purpose to get people around me to understand me without repeating myself. But as far as what I do sound like, I’m not entirely sure. Some sort of odd mix of things I guess, and people usually can’t tell what. I’d actually like to make myself sound Welsh intentionally, which I used to worry would be offensive to those who were from there, like I was appropriating something that wasn’t mine because my family happened to come here before I was around. But then I remembered that so many people try to “perfect” their accents to become either RP or whatever the typical proper American is… So why not decide that Welsh is the “proper” accent and “correct” my speech to that? Anyway, wow I really am rambling now…
Accents are all so interesting to me and I could talk about them for way too long.
Maybe it’s changed? I always said I could never sound like a Gog because I’d swallow my epiglottis trying, while holding my nose. I was very confused at first, on here, because Iestyn sounded SE Valleys and when I tried Aran and Catrin, they didn’t sound at all as I expected! There is one actor who sounds more like I remember Gog’s sounding, but I’ve never found out his name! I have found I am a complete mix of north and south, but years back people were forever asking if I was ‘foreign’ because I picked up expressions and accents and worked with folk from all over the world including the Soviet Union and the Peoples’ Republic!
Maybe - will have to find old clips of “Heddiw” from the 1970s.
Tagart and a few comedians have made the glaswegian accent quite normal now, but I wonder if what we hear now is a little bit mellower than back then as well. There’s some funny old clips of Glaswegians from the '70s who are still almost unintillegible to my ear.
I had a friend from Northamptonshire who went to Oxford and did his PhD at Imperial College, London. Later, his brother came to visit. I literally couldn’t understand a word the brother said and the one I knew sounded like that when speaking to him! In 1945 the POW camp my dad helped to run was in the wilds of that county, but I don’t remember any problems understanding the locals. My mam could understand them and I had to translate for her when we first went to York, later, because she had real trouble with that accent at first!
Sometimes differences must be in very small sub-regions, I think!
That reminds me of a very nice lady I used to know. An American in origin who´d lived many years in England and Europe and spoke fluent German. She´d say, ¨In America they think I´m English and in England they say I´m American; In Austria they think I´m German and in Germany they say I´m Austrian.¨ Sometimes you just can´t win
Hmm … I could manage quite passable Glaswegian (aka Weegie) when I was working in that fair city. Can´t pass up a link to this, which is also of course a take-off of all those cringe-worthy language programs : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52t1CWVTrLE
Mind you genuine language courses from back in the day are similar (Welsh examples ?? ) :
Recently, I saw a program on S4C in which Jerry Hunter, born in USA, Eisteddfod winner and Professor, went to USA to learn about the Trail of Tears and what happened to the Cherokee. When I saw him on TV after he had won at an Eisteddfod (I forget the date) I thought he sounded American. In the recent program, I was struck by the fact that he didn’t sound American!
The point I was rather making was that on our previous visits, we had been changing the language to English. After a while, didn’t find it surprising to be addressed in Welsh, and realised that previously I had been incorrect in my assumptions about the language commonly spoken there. I had been changing people’s mindset before by being unable to speak Welsh- that is to say, we were not changing them now by speaking Welsh.
I’ve said before that I found being able to speak Welsh in such areas frees you from the little bubble of English you carry around with you, imposed on others as much as on yourself.
When I have been on my own in such areas- as a stranger to the area, that is- I just speak Welsh if I hear them speak Welsh, or greet in Welsh and see what they do, go by their accent, sometimes start in Welsh or English, ask if they speak Welsh (in Welsh or English), or not. Exactly the same as in other areas, really. Mostly don’t think about it or plan it, but seem to end up speaking Welsh to an awful lot of people. Not surprisingly!
Well today i met up with @margaretnock in Conwy. A cafe with a Welsh name…“lle mae’r ty bach?”…oh well back to english…but margaret was great…a few silly moments when i used the word for crematorium for museum but otherwise three solid hours of speaking welsh.
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